Conference Realignment Board

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Ummm....16 teams was 1 of many problems because not all 16 members

were happy about which quad they were placed in. In some of the cases, rivalries (i.e. BYU-Hawai'i) were hurt because the 2 teams weren't placed in the same quad.

Also, the schools and their fans from the 2 quads that rotating every 2 years wasn't happy about being included in the group that rotated. Basically they were saying, "Why does my team have to be in the group that rotates instead of X?"

These 2 passage help show it was more than just about distance.

"The 16-team WAC failed from within," Benson says. "There were schools that never bought into the 16 teams. The 10 original WAC members never had buy-in from all the athletic directors and some of the high-profile coaches. They were critics, not supporters.

"The other thing that kept it hard to manage-- the presidents never had a natural North-South or East-West division. There weren't eight teams that naturally fit either East-West or North-South. As a result, we couldn't come up with permanent divisions."

Quad 1 - Hawai'i, Fresno St, San Diego St, San Jose St (Hawai'i upset that its rivalry with BYU suffered)

Quad 2 - UNLV, Air Force, Colorado St, Wyoming (UNLV was upset that its rivalry with San Diego St suffered. A non-natural quad from a geography standpoint)

Quad 3 - BYU, Utah, New Mexico, UTEP (BYU/Utah upset not being placed with the 2 CO and Wyoming schools. UTEP upset about not be placed with the other TX schools. A non-natural quad from a geography standpoint.)

Quad 4 - Tulsa, TCU, SMU, Rice (Maybe the only quad with no complaints about arrangement.)

Quad 1 was always going to be a member of the Pacific Division and Quad 4 was always going to be a member of the Mountain Division. Quad 2 was a member of the Pacific in 1996 and 1997 before switching to the Mountain Division. Quad 3 was the reverse of Quad 2. Since the WAC only played an 8 game conference schedule, 1 cross-division game was played against a team from the paired quads and rotated among those 4 teams.

Quad 1 - Quad 4
Quad 2 - Quad 3

So Quad 4's only complaint is that they got "stuck" playing a CA/HI school every year for a cross-division game which meant they had to travel further for away games than Quad 2 and Quad 3. I believe the WAC used the same quad system as much as possible for all of their sponsored sports.

My point to all of this is that if the ACC did expand to 16 members (regardless whether Notre Dame is included or not), the ACC can't come up with 4 quads that all 16 members could happily agree upon to the point where they would be willing to sacrifice an annual "rivalry game."

(In response to this post by HOO86)

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Posted: 10/18/2018 at 2:54PM

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Current Thread:

Why UCF will not happen.... -- SoCloseHokie 10/11/2018 01:52AM

Simple question, why does anyone want the ACC to expand...without ND? -- EDGEMAN 10/17/2018 1:26PM

16 makes for better football scheduling than 14 -- HOO86 10/18/2018 1:45PM

Only if you’re willing to play 9 conference games -- I85Hokie 10/22/2018 12:25AM

Ask the WAC how a 16 member football conference worked out for them ** -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 2:25PM

16 teams wasn't their problem. 4 time zones was their problem. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 2:32PM

Ummm....16 teams was 1 of many problems because not all 16 members -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 2:54PM

The ACC is only talking about adding 1 or 2 at this point. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 3:20PM

Doubled is a stretch when the WAC already had 10 members -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 3:38PM

The WAC was wacky... -- SoCloseHokie 10/18/2018 5:05PM

Oh I agree the WAC was wacky and probably should have thought -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 5:13PM

I am in favor of addition through subtraction -- VTHokie2000 10/17/2018 6:08PM

You lost me at MDU. ** -- EDGEMAN 10/17/2018 6:33PM

What I am saying is that ideally I wished UMD never left the ACC -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 12:10PM

Connecticut is effectively the same as Maryland. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 1:59PM

I think the myth of the NE market has been exposed. It’s all about -- YardBird 10/26/2018 8:46PM

You missed the point because UConn is not located in the DMV -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 2:10PM

If you have WVU and Pitt in the conference ** -- M-I-C 10/18/2018 4:21PM

If you have WVU and Pitt in the conference -- M-I-C 10/18/2018 4:27PM

I beg to differ -- Tailgate Guru 10/19/2018 09:28AM

Thank you for the compliment that I am under 40 -- M-I-C 10/19/2018 4:51PM

I say let the WVU/VT rivalry stay dead. -- DanNUandVT 10/24/2018 3:58PM

Rutgers? -- Tailgate Guru 10/20/2018 6:03PM

Well... -- M-I-C 10/21/2018 9:09PM

Penn State takes over Heinz Field too. Don't see much difference for Pitt. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 4:41PM

If you re-read my posts, then you will see I made the assumption -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 4:38PM

Neither UVA nor WVU would ever call that a major rivalry -- HOO86 10/18/2018 2:25PM

I think WVU fans would disagree with you -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 2:34PM

WVU rivals -- Millpoint 10/18/2018 10:53PM

For the older generation of WVU, I guess it is possible Syracuse -- VTHokie2000 10/19/2018 2:09PM

For WVU, it's Pitt, Penn State and then everyone else -- Tailgate Guru 10/19/2018 09:35AM

Only UVA fans I know that care about that live in Nova or MD. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 3:05PM

Except WVU may consider those to be older rivalries -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 3:31PM

The ones WVU would bring to the ACC if they would come are Pitt & VT. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 4:43PM

I guess someone forgot to tell WVU that UMD is not a rival -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 5:04PM

It's a rivalry, and it's down the list. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 5:11PM

I disagree that being listed as a third rival is considered to be -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 8:32PM

WVU may desire scheduling Maryland to get a regional game. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 6:38PM

Even if they would like to schedule regional games -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 9:21PM

You have to understand the history of the WVU-Maryland series -- Tailgate Guru 10/19/2018 09:46AM

I have talked to older WVU fans (probably age 60+ or dead now) -- VTHokie2000 10/19/2018 1:52PM

You have no idea what you're talking about -- Tailgate Guru 10/19/2018 4:29PM

Hmmm. some caution -- M-I-C 10/19/2018 4:57PM

I don't know what I am talking about? -- VTHokie2000 10/19/2018 4:39PM

My prior post stands ** -- Tailgate Guru 10/20/2018 5:48PM

Yeah, if UConn was remotely as attractive as MD as a conference member -- reestuart 10/18/2018 2:13PM

Even if they were just as attractive as UMD -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 2:24PM

We had the UM v Rutgers rivalry on display a week ago. -- HOO86 10/24/2018 8:49PM

I never said UMD-Rutgers was a rivalry -- VTHokie2000 10/24/2018 9:48PM

Yep, UConn won’t improve the number of fans in the stands and also won’t -- RJHokie 10/24/2018 9:52PM

The ACC isn't interested in cramming back into the original footprint. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 3:36PM

ACC Interest -- bystander 10/19/2018 09:41AM

Probably best explained from a B1G perspective. -- HOO86 10/19/2018 5:20PM

Wrong again. -- bystander 10/21/2018 7:12PM

Recent FBS level vs stuff over 40 years old? -- HOO86 10/22/2018 10:56AM

They do have those rivalries and they could probably revive them -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 3:49PM

Wake and UConn won't be a rivalry. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 5:06PM

My point was that the conference schedule would be made up -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 5:24PM

I don't get your point. ACC fans won't tune into a bad Wake Maryland game. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 5:45PM

You may be right that fans wouldn't tune into a bad UMD-Wake game -- VTHokie2000 10/18/2018 9:29PM

Yeah, I see no reason to add them. The ACC already has BC, so UConn adds -- reestuart 10/18/2018 2:32PM

Maryland adds nothing as far as market then. They are the same. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 2:41PM

Are UVa & VT really in the DC market? ** -- reestuart 10/18/2018 2:46PM

I watched the UVA Ohio Game in Alexandria. It felt like it. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 3:15PM

I do think most conferences are well represented up there. Maryland is -- reestuart 10/18/2018 3:29PM

I just see a professional sports market. -- HOO86 10/18/2018 4:36PM

I would prefer contraction ** -- VictoryTurkey 10/17/2018 1:50PM

Yep. ** -- reestuart 10/17/2018 6:09PM

+1,000 ** -- EDGEMAN 10/17/2018 4:05PM

"Fetch" will happen before UCF ** -- lawhokie 10/16/2018 8:45PM

Will UCF look as appealing when a big name school hires their coach. -- wwhokie1 10/11/2018 4:39PM

Yep. It will. You buy stock BEFORE it goes up, don’t you.... ** -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/12/2018 08:23AM

Scott Frost left for Nebraska after the Peach Bowl -- mrcaniac 10/12/2018 12:49AM

Too many reason's to list -- Vippie1 10/11/2018 12:32PM

UCF looks like a Big10 school in size and scope -- VictoryTurkey 10/11/2018 11:20PM

Size of school is largely irrelevant -- Vippie1 10/12/2018 10:57AM

You should look closer at UCF, well funded, growing research program ** -- VictoryTurkey 10/13/2018 12:07PM

If you think so... -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/12/2018 08:22AM

A big difference between UCF and ECU is location -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 12:54PM

If ECU was located in Florida, would only play ~3 games per year ** -- EDGEMAN 10/13/2018 08:32AM

Maybe, but it would depend on a couple of things -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 2:10PM

👍 ** -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 1:13PM

Your points... -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 08:34AM

Just because your Nole friends.... -- 2hhoop3 10/11/2018 10:55AM

Factoid prediction.... -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/12/2018 08:29AM

Given that the Big XII's is set to expire here in the next couple of years -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 11:41AM

One slight difference of opinion.... -- 2hhoop3 10/11/2018 11:47AM

Oh, Come on Mr. Swofford!! -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/12/2018 08:33AM

The ACC is probably dumb enough to add UCF, but they won't. -- Mr. Touchdown 10/15/2018 2:04PM

I agree that I don't expect any school to leave prior to 2035 or 2037 -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 12:45PM

The ACC owns the schools rights, not ESPN -- mrcaniac 10/11/2018 10:25PM

I know the ACC owns the rights of the school -- VTHokie2000 10/12/2018 09:26AM

ESPN doesn't "own" the rights -- mrcaniac 10/12/2018 6:43PM

ESPN does own the broadcasting rights to the ACC via its contract -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 05:26AM

True -- mrcaniac 10/13/2018 10:43PM

What I was suggesting is that ESPN negotiate a trade with the ACC -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 11:54PM

Maryland didn't sign the GOR with the ACC -- mrcaniac 10/14/2018 6:13PM

And I am saying that ESPN could end up brokering a deal -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 12:45AM

ESPN pays more and gets nothing more -- mrcaniac 10/15/2018 4:02PM

I understand what you are saying and I don't disagree that could be 1 way -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 4:48PM

Not sure why you like this idea, but -- 33laszlo99 10/15/2018 1:59PM

Yes, I consider that ESPN would see a loss in revenue with the ACC -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 2:34PM

Wildly cost prohibitive -- 33laszlo99 10/12/2018 11:00AM

Here is an article that talks about the rise and fall of the WAC -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 05:37AM

FWIW ESPN entered into a contract with the 8 schools that left the WAC -- VTHokie2000 10/12/2018 11:57AM

The WAC didn't have a GOR -- mrcaniac 10/12/2018 6:56PM

The Big Ten paid most if not all of UMD's exit fee -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 05:33AM

The exit fee is only one part of the problem. The GOR is another. ** -- TerryD 10/19/2018 11:06AM

I don't disagree. I believe that if ESPN thought -- VTHokie2000 10/19/2018 1:27PM

Big10 paid the fee -- mrcaniac 10/14/2018 6:21PM

If a new conference is looking to get off the ground -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 01:03AM

I have to admit -- 33laszlo99 10/12/2018 2:23PM

No worries. Honestly I could see these super conferences as a means -- VTHokie2000 10/12/2018 2:37PM

7 or 8 new conferences -- mrcaniac 10/12/2018 7:36PM

If the conferences are just playing games against themselves -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 05:50AM

Football playoff would only have to be partially modified -- mrcaniac 10/15/2018 4:28PM

It will depend on if the P8s decide to remain a part of a DI subdivision -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 5:02PM

See my reply to HokieGobble.... -- 2hhoop3 10/11/2018 1:56PM

Exactly hence why my scenario the Metro 2.0 has a contract with ESPN -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 2:00PM

All good info & dialogue BUT... -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 12:39PM

You never say never.... -- 2hhoop3 10/11/2018 1:47PM

Very informative info -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 9:13PM

For the same reason people think the ACC should add UConn -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 03:15AM

Big 12 mistake not adding Loserville? -- Millpoint 10/11/2018 11:08AM

The "mistake" is that the Big XII now has an "island problem" called WVU -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 11:35AM

Not how I recall those events... -- M-I-C 10/11/2018 6:07PM

Thanks for correcting some mistakes -- Millpoint 10/12/2018 05:51AM

The Big XII invited TCU to join before adding WVU -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 9:14PM

The Island Angle -- M-I-C 10/12/2018 6:36PM

I seriously doubt all the Big XII teams fly everywhere -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 05:14AM

Bottom line -- Millpoint 10/13/2018 09:31AM

The reason I said the Big XII has an "island problem" with WVU -- VTHokie2000 10/13/2018 2:44PM

Understand what you’re saying -- Millpoint 10/13/2018 6:41PM

The ACC doesn't need to use that scheduling format -- VTHokie2000 10/15/2018 12:59AM

Spot on -- Millpoint 10/12/2018 9:49PM

Big 12... -- SoCloseHokie 10/12/2018 04:28AM

Texas is already king of its castle -- M-I-C 10/12/2018 6:49PM

The ACC has spurned WVU multiple times to the point where that bridge -- VTHokie2000 10/12/2018 09:13AM

Whatever dude -- Millpoint 10/12/2018 09:48AM

I never said WVU wasn't doing fine without the ACC -- VTHokie2000 10/12/2018 10:04AM

If if if -- Millpoint 10/12/2018 12:26PM

Time will tell -- Millpoint 10/12/2018 08:00AM

Fake news -- Millpoint 10/11/2018 5:54PM

Bingo winner of the day -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 08:50AM

Fsu will be potential opposed ** -- SoCloseHokie 10/11/2018 03:21AM

FSU and even Miami may oppose the expansion, but it doesn't mean -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 10:13AM

They will have the votes -- Mercury 10/11/2018 1:39PM

Why do you think those schools you mentioned wouldn't want -- VTHokie2000 10/11/2018 1:42PM

Yes and no me thinks as .... -- HOKIEGOBBLE 10/11/2018 08:53AM

Don't sell yourself short....... -- 2hhoop3 10/11/2018 11:02AM

Ummm....16 teams was 1 of many problems because not all 16 members

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